Comments on: Signature in the Cell http://www.asa3online.org/Book/2010/01/01/signature-in-the-cell/ A members' forum for discussion of selected books Mon, 23 Aug 2010 05:09:04 -0500 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.6 hourly 1 By: David Wallace http://www.asa3online.org/Book/2010/01/01/signature-in-the-cell/comment-page-1/#comment-178 David Wallace Sat, 27 Mar 2010 03:36:49 +0000 http://www.asa3online.org/Book/?p=41#comment-178 Randy wrote: "As I stated in one of my comments, one can even show that a system has a tendency to increase information." Of course. A running system tends to increase entropy and thus Shannon information increases as they are proportional. Randy wrote:

“As I stated in one of my comments, one can even show that a system has a tendency to increase information.”

Of course. A running system tends to increase entropy and thus Shannon information increases as they are proportional.

]]> By: Mervin Bitikofer http://www.asa3online.org/Book/2010/01/01/signature-in-the-cell/comment-page-1/#comment-176 Mervin Bitikofer Sat, 20 Mar 2010 03:21:13 +0000 http://www.asa3online.org/Book/?p=41#comment-176 Thanks, Randy.  I guess I'm still learning how to navigate this forum and only saw these few early posts.  Your link took me to the mother-load.  Yikes!  The fire-hose is back.  It will take me more than I can do tonight to catch up on all of that; but I do see right away that the antibody question is one featured topic.   Right now my attention is also pulled towards another book of Dembski's I just finished, and I may try to start a separate topic thread about that.  (Unless one is already started and I just haven't clicked to the right place to see it.) --Merv Thanks, Randy.  I guess I’m still learning how to navigate this forum and only saw these few early posts.  Your link took me to the mother-load.  Yikes!  The fire-hose is back.  It will take me more than I can do tonight to catch up on all of that; but I do see right away that the antibody question is one featured topic.
 
Right now my attention is also pulled towards another book of Dembski’s I just finished, and I may try to start a separate topic thread about that.  (Unless one is already started and I just haven’t clicked to the right place to see it.)
–Merv

]]> By: Randy Isaac http://www.asa3online.org/Book/2010/01/01/signature-in-the-cell/comment-page-1/#comment-174 Randy Isaac Sat, 20 Mar 2010 01:41:43 +0000 http://www.asa3online.org/Book/?p=41#comment-174 <p>Yes, Merv, that's precisely my point in these <a href="../../../../02/16/complex-specified-information-without-an-intelligent-source/" rel="nofollow">posts</a>. Maybe it's clearer in some of the comments. There simply is no "conservation principle" for information. As I stated in one of my comments, one can even show that a system has a tendency to increase information. It is only one of the fatal errors of Meyer's argument. Go ahead and take your time to read all the posts and the comments. Time won't expire on these so go ahead and ask your questions Randy</p> Yes, Merv, that’s precisely my point in these posts. Maybe it’s clearer in some of the comments. There simply is no “conservation principle” for information. As I stated in one of my comments, one can even show that a system has a tendency to increase information. It is only one of the fatal errors of Meyer’s argument. Go ahead and take your time to read all the posts and the comments. Time won’t expire on these so go ahead and ask your questions
Randy

]]> By: Mervin Bitikofer http://www.asa3online.org/Book/2010/01/01/signature-in-the-cell/comment-page-1/#comment-173 Mervin Bitikofer Fri, 19 Mar 2010 22:35:44 +0000 http://www.asa3online.org/Book/?p=41#comment-173 Just finished reading this & would love to carry on discussion.  Am I a day late & dollar short?  I notice these posts are months old. I did post my own review of the book on my own web site in case anyone wants to read of some of my impressions. http://www.mbitikofer.com/opinions.html#ID I thought it was at the Biologos site that I read one reaction in which Meyer's assertion that no new (or greater quantity) of specified information has ever been created in an [isolated] system.  Yet the reviewer I read insisted that this information conservation 'principle' is broken every time our cells develop new antibodies to some newly evolved germ.  Now I can't find reference to the question, but I was curious if that is a serious challenge to Meyer and how it might be answered. --Merv Just finished reading this & would love to carry on discussion.  Am I a day late & dollar short?  I notice these posts are months old.
I did post my own review of the book on my own web site in case anyone wants to read of some of my impressions.
http://www.mbitikofer.com/opinions.html#ID
I thought it was at the Biologos site that I read one reaction in which Meyer’s assertion that no new (or greater quantity) of specified information has ever been created in an [isolated] system.  Yet the reviewer I read insisted that this information conservation ‘principle’ is broken every time our cells develop new antibodies to some newly evolved germ.  Now I can’t find reference to the question, but I was curious if that is a serious challenge to Meyer and how it might be answered.
–Merv

]]> By: Allan Harvey http://www.asa3online.org/Book/2010/01/01/signature-in-the-cell/comment-page-1/#comment-13 Allan Harvey Mon, 11 Jan 2010 19:18:33 +0000 http://www.asa3online.org/Book/?p=41#comment-13 I look forward to the essay review in PSCF. In the meantime, there is a thoughtful review (leaning negative but gracious in tone) at the BioLogos site from Christian biology Prof. Darrel Falk: http://biologos.org/blog/signature-in-the-cell/ I look forward to the essay review in PSCF.

In the meantime, there is a thoughtful review (leaning negative but gracious in tone) at the BioLogos site from Christian biology Prof. Darrel Falk:
http://biologos.org/blog/signature-in-the-cell/

]]> By: James Patterson http://www.asa3online.org/Book/2010/01/01/signature-in-the-cell/comment-page-1/#comment-12 James Patterson Fri, 08 Jan 2010 11:57:57 +0000 http://www.asa3online.org/Book/?p=41#comment-12 I have read the book, and was impressed by the information. I do think the author could have written the book more succinctly, it's a bit wordy. But that is by no means critiquing the content. This book, along with several others, including Behe's "Edge of Evolution" present some serious challenges to the TE model. Another big one is a recent volume of ANYAS - v1178, 2009. The lead article is by James Shapiro...titled "Revisiting the Central Dogma in the 21st Century". I am going to start a new post about that one...it's really good. I have read the book, and was impressed by the information. I do think the author could have written the book more succinctly, it’s a bit wordy. But that is by no means critiquing the content. This book, along with several others, including Behe’s “Edge of Evolution” present some serious challenges to the TE model.

Another big one is a recent volume of ANYAS – v1178, 2009. The lead article is by James Shapiro…titled “Revisiting the Central Dogma in the 21st Century”. I am going to start a new post about that one…it’s really good.

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